Changing Struts/Shocks

Changing Struts/Shocks

Hi,

I have a question, Last winter we changed the wheels on a 99 Corolla from 14" stocks to 15" Alloys. since we changed them when we any kind of bump or pot hole, the tires rub and we get a scraping noise, and we know it's the tire that is scraping against the fender, because we can see the scrape marks on the tires.

So without rolling the fenders (which we don't know how to do, or know the costs), we figured it was time to change the shocks/struts on the car since it has gone over 100K miles 2 months ago. I am planning on going with the KYB GR2 Gas struts and was wondering if anyone had any recommendations as if this was ok or if there are other struts/shocks I should look into. I'm not sure if I should change the springs as well, since I'm not too familiar with them, and if I do what are some good springs to look into, I heard about the Tien series but I think only the H ones are the ones that don't lower the car is this correct. We are trying to do as little change as possible to the car (like no lowering), but would like to get good quality parts to last us. Are there any other parts we should get changed as well since we are doing this area?

And if we change the shocks/struts and springs would this pretty much solver our problems with the tire scraping?

EDIT: I don't think anything has ever been changed in the car and that the parts are OEM from the previous owner.

Thanks in advance!

either KYB or Tokico(for the most common struts). your car DOES NOT have shocks. it's up to you if you want to change the springs...i'd recommend a mild drop for increased handling, but that's entirely my preference. Intrax springs give a nice drop, as do TRD/Eibach springs. if you go with KYB, any of these springs will fit nicely. if you go with Tokico, avoid the TRDs and go with Intrax instead.

did you upgrade to stock alloys?

kybs n H&R springs here and i couldnt be happier, got with kybs or tokicos and def roll those fenders, save alot of stress n time theres no getting around it

that's bull. i've never had to roll my fenders and my car's lowered almost 2 inches.

to honestly tell you the truth I don't know what rolling the fenders means what it implies we have to do. But we are trying to keep the car at about the same, without lowering.

It depends on the offset of the rims not how much/little the car is lowered because either way under full suspension compression your wheels/tries would want to tuck into the wheel well. Stock rims have a high offset so they push back towards the insider of the wheel well more than the new rims. Your new rims probablly have a lower offset so they are more push out towards the fenders. The simple solution is to "roll your fenders," (if you put your hand under your rear fenders you would feel a 1/2" lip, rolling your fenders mean rolling that lip up towards the inside of your fender) and that would clear up about 1/2" of space for the additional offset. That is accomplished by using a fender method or the half assed method with a baseball bat.

Other problems may be you are running incorrect tire size or that your alignment is messed up so that you have really positive camber. Since you have almost 100k, your struts might be going too, so you might want to get some KYB GR-2 replacement struts before the alignment and kill 2 bears with one stone.

[edit]
oops.. I just read that you are using Corolla OEM alloy wheels? in that case its most likely not the offset. Are youb bottoming out or is the tires just hitting the aforementioned fender lip?

well just change the springs/struts to OEM dude..... I'm going with some H techs and Tokico's for a very mild drop yet sporty hehehe

No we bought aftermarket rims from Town Fair Tire, along with a set of BF tires. what happens is that when we go over any bumps or pot holes the tires rub up against the fenders. we are going to be changing the struts so figured we had to change teh springs as well. I hope this would fix the probles as I still don't know how to roll the fenders.

with a hammer dude that's all it's quick and easy process just make sure not to roll it too much..... change ur springs at least and feel the difference first cause u might not even need struts... I dk just a money saving idea

I think the rubbing issue is just because your spring/struts are too old, not strong enough to absorb the "bounce". You can test it buy push down the front or rear and see how many times does the car bounces back. With good struts, it will only bounces once.

what springs gave you a 2 inch drop

check the sticker inside your rim for offset information, and check the tires size.

No you would not have to upgrade your springs with aftermarket struts (but you can if you want). Struts wear over time, springs may sag a little but they're pretty much good for the life of the car. Aftermarket OEM replacement struts like KYB GR2 and Tokico HP series were designed for OEM springs as well as aftermarket spring, hence "OEM replacement struts."

On the other hand NEVER upgrade your springs without aftermarket struts. dampening force plays a larger role than spring rate when it comes to suspension. Not only is OEM struts not valved to handle the spring rate of aftermarket springs, OEM struts would not be able to take the decreased amount of stroke from lowering springs. On a ~100k mile car you would just be asking for a full scale strut blowout.

As for rolling your fenderes, if you dont feel you're up to the task of rolling them yourself you can ask around rims shops or bodyshops. But you could find the baseball bat method on google. I myself rented a fender roller, not only is my fender lip rolled all the way but My fenders flares out a bit more

intrax gives a 1.8" drop. that's nearly 2 inches. i've NEVER had a rubbing issue, both with aftermarket and stock wheels.

You guys should work on your troubleshooting skills. All his problems started with the wheel/tire change. Probably a combination of either (a) terribly wrong offset or (b) too big tires. No matter what he does, with that tire/wheel combo its gonna be RIGGED UP. He should sell that crap and get something that fits. Obviously the wheel seller can't be trusted.

Why re-engineer the entire suspension because you have the WRONG wheels/tires to begin with? It would be more cost effective and save a lot of hassle to just get some wheels/tires that FIT CORRECTLY. ~

but if they upgraded to STOCK alloys, then it's either the tires or the suspension. stock alloys fit.

His previous message side he brought aftermarket wheels. So i'm trying to figure out the offset and tire size before I can tell him exactly whats wrong.

And as I said before, struts dont last forever they're usually good for about 100k give or take, and he said hes close to 100k. replaceing your OEM struts with OEM replacement struts is not "re-engineering his suspension." From personal experience you can rub on 15X7 with +38 offset and 205/50/15's if you have slightly positive camber (misalignment), back then I was on TRD Japan Race spec spring with a 3kg/mm spring rate .08" drop (highest spring rate and smallest drop out of any avilable production lowering springs) in the rear. I said it before and I'll say it again, spring rates and lowering has nothing to do with rubbing.. well unless you're rubbing the top of your wheel well. The wheel would want to move up and down no matter what, thats the job of the suspension. If there is no gap between the wheel and the fender while the car is at rest, think of what the suspension would want to do during cornering or when you hit a bump. The fender lip is less than a inch from the tire, the thing that determine if you would hit it is the offset, tire size (width), or alignment (camber)

his post doesn't specifically say aftermarket - just says alloys.

ok, so i missed it. i'm a dumb girl - we know this.

You're not dumb, and I thank you for the help as well as everyone else. I figured I should have gone and gotten the specs of the tire/wheel combinantion that we bought so here it is...

Wheels:
Alloy Motegi Racing
15x6.5 (the rim says JJ after that dunno what that means)

Tires:

BF Goodrich Traction T/A
195/55R15

now a friend (who happens to be our mechanic as well) says that I should change the springs along with the shocks/struts. I've figured we will probably go with the KYB GR2 shocks. Now I assume if I change the springs as well (trying to find ones that don't lower the car at all) this would solve my rubbing issue in the rear. Is this correct? What springs should I look into as well? I have heard about the Tien H Techs but will they lower the car at all?

I can't find any offset information, as for the sizes, I actually got the recommendations off of TireRack, the mechanic said they were ok, and so did TownFair, I think I posted it up on this forum as well to make sure.

dont worry about it, you could catch me doing the same thing.

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Well the rims/tire size is a very good/safe match, I have a wider rim/tire and a pretty low offset (+38) and I would still clear (barely) at zero camber. My bet is your mortegis are +40 (because they usually are) but if you know the model you could probably look it up on the web... IMO with that setup you really shouldn't be rubbing. (offset info is sometime stamped on the inner spoke of the rim)

I'm goina go back to the theory that your suspension/alignment is the problem. Honestly in my professional opinion, the springs does not need to be replaced. But its up to you. Problem is all aftermarket springs I know of lower about 1" (I cannot give you the exact specs by brand but you can ask around here) and toyota parts dept will charge up the ass for OEM (its about ~300ea for a single OEM strut). For specs on Tein H-Tech, check the tein website itself, they have a downloadable spec sheet for the exact spring/car application you are looking for.
http://www.tein.com/ti/l02.html

I believe these are the Rims we bought, I can't verify till I look at the car again. and the Receipt.

But I believe these are the ones the MR7's

http://www.motegiracing.com/wheels/...&desc=&section=

+35offset, that makes sense.. Yeah the offset is pretty low. All you really need to do is roll your fenders, that should tie you over until your struts really go. Unless you think your suspension is bad now.

The suspension is pretty weak. How much does it usually cost to roll fenders?

you *could* do it yourself without a problem.

http://vamp.darkravers.net/DIYRollingFenders.cfm

A local place (in SF) rented me a fender roller + a heat gun for $35 for the weekend, they're kinda a rare tool but does a perfect job. I did my own car along with a few of my buddys to get the money worth. I hear professional service cost around $75. The basball bat thing works too I guess, depend on if you can trust yourself doing it. I'd recommend heating the paint up with a heat gun to make it less prone to cracking/chipping off.

Normally I would not only recommend but stress upgrading your suspension, but it sounds like youre not intrested in doing too many modifications.

Yeah, We don't want to modify the car much, but as parts in the car start giving out, we are upgrading them to better quality parts, without altering the car. I.E. Break disc will get changed to the top quality type, if muffler goes that will get changed as well, probably to a TRD one (it dropped on me, as the holder bolt rusted off, but we were able to get a bolt to hold it back into place)

But since the suspension is giving out on us now, I will probably get the KYB GR2. And probably try to find springs that would go along with them without lowering the car (or not by much, the less the better)

ok i'm not gonna read this.. odds are, tires are too big or wrong offset, or some horrible alignment. odds r tires are too big or wrong offset (hence why u stay away from town fairs)...

I was running.. 17's w/ 205/40R17 tires, as low as my coilovers would let me, no issues whatsoever with rubbing. i only rolled my fenders cause my friends got on my ass about it, plus i was planning on slipping 18's on it (never happened)

we already determined the offset was the problem, a mis-alignment might be the 2nd piece of the puzzel tho. 195mm tires and 6.5" (width) rims is already leaving a lot of legroom, I'm running 205mm and 7" (width) rims.

cewong: sounds good,, i'm not an expert on lowering springs so ask around on that, good luck with getting the rubbing problem fixed.

Thanks jspexae102,

Does anyone know of any springs to go with GR2s that won't lower the car by much, the H Techs seems to lower the car by about a little less than an inch.