News NYPD Boo Boo

He can say you dont know what youre talking about because you have already made assumptions about it all just because police are involved. We all know that you are a police hater. (until you need their help).
Cadetlee isnt making flat out generalizations...he has family that are officers and can relate to how police work.
You came into this thread calling for these officers to hang, without bringing up any questions about what actually occured. (And before more facts about the case had come about)

You get on the force?

Why are you basing all of your opinions on this on a very vague video that was released a few hours after the incident? Before any investigation??

Sure ya did! You were trying to justify that it isnt a deadly weapon unless you are going 30mph+ and you can jump out of the way.

No, I dont agree. Especially in the close quarters of that very narrow street, with cars surrounding the suspects car. That car was fucked up. Its obvious that they were trying to escape!

Thanks!


I think the officer that unloaded 31 shots should definately get some sort of punishment/discipline. 15 seconds to unload 31 shots easily, but still, very excessive.

How long was your academy?

NEW YORK (AP) -- New York Mayor Michael Bloomberg said Monday that officers appeared to use excessive force when they fired 50 shots at an unarmed man just hours before his wedding.

The shooting occurred outside a Queens strip club that was under investigation for drugs and prostitution.

"I can tell you that it is to me unacceptable or inexplicable how you can have 50-odd shots fired," said Bloomberg. "But that's up to the investigation to find out what really happened."

The mayor's comments came at a news conference after he met with elected officials and community leaders including the Rev. Al Sharpton and New York Democratic Rep. Charles Rangel.

The groom, Sean Bell, 23, was killed and two of his friends wounded early Saturday after a bachelor party at the Kalua Cabaret.

Police said they fired their guns because they thought the men were armed.

They were not.

"They were murderers"
In her first public comments on the shooting, Bell's fiancee, Nicole Paultre, told a radio station Monday that the people who shot her husband shouldn't be called officers.

"They were murderers, murderers," she told hip-hop station Power 105.1. "They were not officers. No one gives anyone the right to kill somebody." (Watch an angry crowd count down the number of shots fired )

Sharpton called the conference of leaders a "very candid" meeting.

He said the message to Bloomberg was: "This city must show moral outrage that 50 shots were fired on three unarmed men."

Some have also questioned whether the shooting was racially motivated because the victims were all black men.

The five officers who fired their guns included two blacks, two whites and one Hispanic.

Of the victims, Bloomberg said Monday: "There is no evidence that they were doing anything wrong," referring to everything leading up to the moment they struck the officer with their car. (Watch Mayor Bloomberg push for a grand jury probe )

For a mayor to question the actions of the officers and defend the shooting victims -- while reaching out immediately to the grieving community -- sets a decidedly different tone than in the past.

Former Mayor Rudy Giuliani was hounded for what some viewed as a slow response to the killing of Amadou Diallo, an unarmed West African immigrant who was shot 19 times in the Bronx by four white officers.

They were later acquitted of criminal charges.

The gunfire in the current case stemmed from an undercover operation inside the Kalua Cabaret, where seven officers in plain clothes were investigating alleged prostitution and drug use.

Police Commissioner Raymond Kelly has said the groom was involved in an argument outside the club after 4 a.m., and one of his friends made a reference to a gun.

An undercover officer walked closely behind Bell and his friends as they headed for their car. As he walked toward the front of the vehicle, Bell and his friend drove forward -- striking him and an undercover police vehicle, Kelly said.

The officer who had followed the group on foot was apparently the first to open fire, Kelly said.

One 12-year veteran fired his weapon 31 times, emptying two full magazines, Kelly said.

Bloomberg supports commissioner
Bloomberg also said police appeared to have violated the policy stating that officers cannot shoot at a vehicle being used as a weapon if no other deadly force is involved.

But Bloomberg was steadfast in his support for Kelly, who has been denounced by some activists since the shooting.

The five officers were placed on paid administrative leave and were stripped of their guns during the investigation.

Queens District Attorney Richard A. Brown said Monday the results of his office's investigation would be presented to a grand jury.

He said he had spoken with the mayor and police commissioner and had met with Sharpton, Bell's parents and Paultre.

"I will be guided only by the law and the facts," Brown said in a statement. "I will reach no conclusions until the investigation is complete. There will be no rush to judgment."

Michael Palladino, president of the Detectives' Endowment Association, defended the officers' actions and said police were responding to the threat of the car.

"The amount of shots fired does not spell out excessive to me," Palladino said.

Giuliani's response to the 1999 Diallo killing sparked protests nearly every day for weeks around City Hall, where demonstrators accused his administration of trampling the civil rights of blacks and Latinos.

Bloomberg's allies these days include some who were once at odds with Giuliani.

Sharpton acknowledged that the tone has changed, but said courtesy only goes so far.

"This man has better manners than his predecessor. Let's see if we have better policy ... because we're not just interested in being treated politely," Sharpton said. "We're interested in being treated fairly and rightly."

Bloomberg told reporters he did not believe the shooting was racially motivated but said "it's clear that people in this city do feel that they are sometimes stopped, frisked, whatever, based on their ethnicity," and he said his administration would work to prevent that.

The mayor planned to meet with the victim's family as soon as it was appropriate, and said he would also visit the community in Queens.

Paultre made a quiet visit to the shooting site before dawn Monday, lighting candles clustered around a photo of the smiling couple with one of their daughters.

The survivors were Joseph Guzman, 31, who was shot at least 11 times, and Trent Benefield, 23, who was hit three times.

Guzman was in critical condition and Benefield in stable condition Monday.

Copyright 2006 The Associated Press. All rights

Ah. Weird setup.

Put the amount of shots aside. Lets pretend 3 of the 5 officers shot one bullet only, and they all hit their mark.

Whos to blame? Is it still all the cops fault? Maybe they were stopping them for drunk driving, and the people in the car freaked out. Maybe them trying to be all thug like and saying they were going to get their gun was a bad move......

The fact that the one cop unloaded 31 shots is a seperate issue.

We have entertained the idea that the cops were wrong. You have YET to entertain the idea that the cops were right. Do you not realize that?

So my perspective is always wrong? I look at both sides. Something that you never do. Ive asked you blatant questions regarding this, and you skip em.

Cool, I see what youre all about now. How bout ya lose the emoticons for once, and have a serious conversation instead of throwing out the sarcastic remarks and skirting the pertinent questions. We can all see that you are a cop hater, and refuse to look at the other side of things.

New York Cops Questioned Over Groom Killing
Sharpton Likens 50-Bullet Barrage to 'Firing Squad'
By TOM HAYS, AP

NEW YORK (Nov. 28) - It began as a routine undercover operation involving unarmed police officers patrolling a sketchy nightclub by trying to blend in with patrons.



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Watch Video: Mayor Calls Shooting 'Unacceptable'

Talk About It: Post Thoughts


But by the end of the evening, a 50-bullet police barrage - likened to a "firing squad" by the Rev. Al Sharpton - killed a groom-to-be, injured two of his friends and ignited concerns over police tactics and firepower.

Mayor Michael Bloomberg said Monday that the police response seemed "unacceptable" and "inexplicable" to him, but he was steadfast in his support for Police Commissioner Raymond Kelly, who has been denounced by some activists since the shooting.

Queens District Attorney Richard A. Brown said Monday that his office was investigating the Saturday morning shootings and the results would be presented to a grand jury.

"I will be guided only by the law and the facts," Brown said in a statement. "I will reach no conclusions until the investigation is complete. There will be no rush to judgment."

The groom, Sean Bell, 23, was killed and two of his friends wounded after a bachelor party at the strip club the night before his wedding. The men were unarmed.

The undercover operation that began 1 a.m. Saturday at the strip club Kalua Cabaret was part of a citywide crackdown sparked by the case of a New Jersey teenager who was abducted, raped and killed following a night of partying earlier this year at a Manhattan nightclub.

Police said they had received several complaints about prostitution and drug dealing at Kalua Cabaret in Queens before sending in two undercover detectives who left their guns behind because of searches at the door.



The detectives apparently spent the next few hours nursing drinks and mingling with the crowd. Critics have questioned why the officers were allowed to consume alcohol, but police officials said the officers weren't impaired.

"We authorize them to have two drinks, and not more," said Kelly.

The situation began to unravel when one of the officers alerted the back-up team outside that a man inside was possibly armed. During a later altercation among patrons, police claim they heard a member of Bell's bachelor party, say, "Yo, get my gun."

One of the undercover detectives responded by retrieving his weapon and confronting Bell and his friends after they entered their car. Kelly suggested that it was unorthodox for the officer to blow his cover rather than rely on other officers to make the arrest.

"He was still acting in an undercover capacity when he followed the group down the street and apparently took some enforcement action, and that was unusual," Kelly said.

Union officials insist the detective took out his badge, identified himself and ordered the men to stop before the car, driven by Bell, lurched forward and bumped him. The vehicle then smashed into an unmarked police van, backed up and smashed the van again before the shooting began.

The crashes - along with the fear that one of the men had a gun - seem to be what escalated the situation to a hail of gunfire by five officers.

It is not immediately clear if the men in the car knew they were dealing with a police officer. Friends and family have speculated Bell got spooked by having a gun pointed at his vehicle, possibly crashing the car in a panic.

The NYPD discourages officers from firing on a moving vehicle. But Michael Palladino, president of the Detectives Endowment Association, argued that the officers had a right to fire if the car posed a lethal threat.

"The driver of that vehicle - his actions were a contributing factor," Palladino said. "The amount of shots fired does not spell out excessive to me."

In her first public comments on the shooting, Bell's fiancee, Nicole Paultre, told a radio station Monday that the people who shot her husband shouldn't be called officers.

"They were murderers, murderers," she told hip-hop station Power 105.1. "They were not officers. No one gives anyone the right to kill somebody."

None of the five unidentified officers had ever fired their 16-shot semiautomatic pistols on patrol before that morning, officials said. The undercover officer fired first, squeezing off 11 rounds; another, a 12-year-veteran, fired 31 times, meaning he paused to reload.

Officials said all the officers would have received training to combat against "contagious or sympathetic fire" - when police become disoriented by the sound of friendly fire and blast away at a phantom threat.

"We stress when officers go to the range that they fire no more than three rounds and then assess what the situation is," Kelly said.

The 37,000-officer New York Police Department, the nation's largest, trains its members on "how to defend themselves and not use excessive force," Bloomberg said Monday. "What exactly happened here, we do not know."

Contagious fire would not be a valid excuse, Sharpton said.

"To say that one gun causes an atmosphere where you keep shooting is to tell me that if one policeman makes a mistake, you could be subjected... to what amounts to a firing squad," he said.

The survivors were Joseph Guzman, 31, who was shot at least 11 times, and Trent Benefield, 23, who was hit three times. Guzman was in critical condition, and Benefield in stable condition Monday.

Great post??? Thats what we've been saying the entire time!! You agree with him, but not with us? He is seeing both sides of the situation here. You came into the thread with your opinion on the situation already decided on. You agree with him saying that he finds it hard to believe that the cops didnt identify themselves? Of course you dont, you saw the video. You agree with him saying that he finds it hard to believe that the suspects didnt do anything to provoke the shooting??? Of course not, you think they were just scared.

You can lace your replies with as much condescending and sarcastic remarks as youd like, but its only showing that you know that you were wrong to begin with. Now you can come back with some more of your emoticons and try to make us look like we're the bad guys as well. You like to try to point out the fact that we dont think we're ever wrong.....take a look in the mirror pal. You have your one sided opinion on the matter, and you refuse to look at the other side of it. At least we question both sides and have an open mind about it. Something that you never have.

Back away from arguing about real world smarts situations and stick to arguing about book based stuff like computer desktops, Linux, and databases. It seems that at least you have some knowledge in that sort of shit.

Its easily recognizable that at least I look at both sides of the situation. Something that you HAVE NOT DONE.

Fine, you win. You have clearly considered both sides of the situation.

What would it matter, youve already made up your mind about the situation.