Forced Induction ECU always compensating for eManage

ECU always compensating for eManage

Alright, so I finally got my Wideband O2 sensor installed on Motor v2.0 and it is telling me exactly why my last motor blew. You see when you increase the values in the eManage on the fuel map (additional injection) and rev the engine the wideband shows the AFR drop to 12.00 right where I want it and then within a second or two it creeps back up to 14.00? WTF. Then when I let off the gas it spikes rich and then the ECU comes back to 14. What this tells me is that the eManage is 100% useless in the closed loop system, unless I run WOT where the fixed ECU map is used I cannot effectively tune the car? How has anyone else got around this little snag? It is obvious to me now that when I was running my last motor it was running rich and then the ECU brought it back to 14AFR and then when I punched it to the floor it went back to the fixed map and spiked 100% lean and blew the engine to pieces. I am really good the wideband has given me enough information to see exactly how the eManage and ECU are fighting I just want to know how to get around it.

Questions...
Q) How do I tell the eManage to only use its map at WOT
Q) How can I tell the ECU on the car to only use the open loop map and ignore its automated tuning all togather

I can drive the car around right now with a zero'd map and the car seems to figure out how to maintain the 14 AFR no matter what, but as soon as I got WOT the thing runs lean as hell because it goes to the opened loop map. I think this is the final puzzle I need to solve to make my car drivable

i heard that you should stay away from piggybacks and go with a standalone

I dont think they make a standalone for the corolla. If they do I'm all ears Also if I can get the stock ECU in to opened loop then the piggy back will work just like a standalone since it will be sitting on top of a static map.

I remember vamp mentioning something about this subject in one of his past writeups.

didn't he connect something the piggyback into the ECU to make it go tilt?

hmmm *searches*

SaberJ2X added 4 Minutes and 25 Seconds later...

http://vamp.darkravers.net/cpg/thumbnails.php?album=66

Underdog Racing has the ESC1, which is what I use to make my ECU stop pulling fuel when it sees 1psi. have my eManage autotune all fueling above 1.5psi.

We made 220+hp using an emanage blue on a 2001 Corolla. You just need to take it to a pro tuner and have it done right.

-Doc

Hey Tweak, what do you mean by "Done Right". What could the professionals do to make the eManage not get attacked by the factory ECU when in closed loop operation? I'm excited to get 220+ out of my little Corolla, how many PSI were you running to get it? I tried tuning with both the Airflow map and the Injector map and both of them add fuel perfectly for about 1 second until the ECU takes over and steals it back to 14.7 AFR. If I jam it too the floor then my map works fine but the second I let off the gas the AFR goes SUPER LEAN and back fires since the ECU tries to do a quick correction from an invalid value. Sounds like the ESC-1 is the way to go for around town driving but I want your thoughts and information since you are the god of all that is cam's and pistons

Thanks,
Jerry

Jerry,

Well, for one thing, you HAVE TO HAVE TO HAVE TO HAVE TO tune it on a dyno. What you are doing is sitting at idle or cruising and you're in closed loop, so the ECU is reading the 02 sensor and fixing the AFR. Which is good. When you go into a higher TPS reading (ie, you step on the gas), the ECU switches out of closed loop and starts reading off the map, which is what you can tune by using the Emanage. You don't really need to worry about tuning the idle and cruising cells as long as it's close because the engine isn't under load in those cells, it's only the loaded cells you need to worry about and the only way to safely get into those cells and be able to pay attention to what's going on is on a dyno.

The only other thing you can do is street tune it, you have to have two people, or if you're doing it yourself, you need to be able to record the settings. Do a run, then let the car sit and look over the recording of the run, then go make your corrections, then make another run. This is very difficult to do unless you own a stretch of road that you can close off from everyone else (ie, a track). Also there is simply no way to measure any differences when you're tuning your timing unless you are on a 1/4 mile track and run it exactly the same each time and can compare your times. I DON'T recommend street tuning it!

We were running 10psi, Greddy Emanage blue, 365cc (I think) injectors, GT2860RS turbo, high-density intercooler.

-Doc

The only problem with that Tweak is that my turbo is super touchy, it builds like 2lb of boost when I put the throttle to 5% The ECU does not open closed loop unless I stop on it which means I'm in boost most of the time even when in closed loop operation. I think I'm going to need an ESC-1 since my turbo is so sensitive. If I stop on the gas then the numbers comes down where I want them on the emanage because I only say add more gas after 1psi of boost, however if I just push down the gas gentil and take off the turbo builds 2 - 3lb of boost and the engine leans way out unless I stop on it and then it goes to opened loop, maybe I should have got a bigger turbo and I would not have this problem The other thing I noticed is when I had the 550 injectors in the car always ran rich because even when the ECU did a full fuel trim I was still at 13AFR, the problem with that ofcourse was that the ECU would try to learn down to full trim and then when I went in to slight boost and let off the car would die because it would go back in to closed loop and the AFR would fly in to the clouds comming off the emanage readings and the ECU would take me down to an AFR of like 5 and then the car would die or make wicked back fires I wish I had a dyno so I could play around a little more then my street tuning and logging however I think I would even like it more if I could get my car out of closed loop operation under any boost condition since my turbo is very very spunky. I'm going to get the ESC-1 tomorrow from a guy that is locally selling it to me for $70 so we'll see if that helps thing as all, if not I might ahve to find a dyno somewhere around here to tune it but I think most shops charge literarry hundreds of dollars and hour to use there dyno.

2psi isn't enough to cause a problem, especially since your throttle position is so low, the actual VE of the engine is very low. We were running a GT2860RS ball-bearing on the '01 that we did and it was also a very responsive turbo.

-Doc